The rags and Dippers wanting to reduce the EPL to 18 and do away with the League Cup
Martin Samuel ( Daily Mail) nails it once again:
"This is, in essence, every rotten, contemptuous, self-serving, destructive idea the likes of Manchester United and Liverpool have come up with across the last two decades, repurposed as a rescue package.
Project Big Picture? Far from saving our game, all it would do is reduce. Reduce what makes football fun. Reduce its unpredictability, reduce the excitement, reduce the chances for Wolves or Leicester or Aston Villa. Reduce the hope of a change of ownership at Newcastle. Reduce your chances of promotion. Reduce your hopes of success if you get there. Reduce, reduce, reduce."
Have City agreed to do this as well? If so then im very disappointed considering where we have come from.
Was just thinking that. After our efforts to expose FFP and smashing up UEFA it would be very hypocritical of us to back this.
Quote from: lee on October 12, 2020, 08:32:09
Have City agreed to do this as well? If so then im very disappointed considering where we have come from.
Yes, all the reports I’ve seen say City are in favour. In some ways I can see this is disappointing, but the from the club’s point of view the prospect of the plan going ahead and City being left out must be just unthinkable.
City are in the group which are supportive but have concerns.
Media quote - "A wider meeting of the Big Six held on Thursday, which also involved Manchester City and Arsenal, broke up without an agreement being reached."
However, I am sure their concerns are not ours or fans concerns. As this proposal centres power for decision making into the hands of 9 clubs in the PL and requires only a vote of 6 clubs in favour of a proposal, I imagine that is City's concern and rightly so.
All that is needed is 3 clubs from the big 6 (any combination from Liverpool, Utd, Arsenal, Chelsea, Spurs) plus the 3 non big 6 (Everton, West Han, Southampton) bribed and major changes can be passed e.g. A UEFA League played at weekends, detrimental English football supporters and the interests of the City Football Group and City. Madness if City agree to this honeytrap.
Just look at the small print these clubs can veto future new owners.
If Liverpool are leading it, it will only be to their advantage. Hopefully we’re not supporting this given how much the dippers have tried to interfere in our affairs to our detriment.
Quote from: Hesperus on October 12, 2020, 13:07:02
If Liverpool are leading it, it will only be to their advantage. Hopefully we’re not supporting this given how much the dippers have tried to interfere in our affairs to our detriment.
Well, I think that Liverpool (and Rags) will be engineering this so that City will be in a lose:lose situation. So in the event that their project proposal looks like it will be accepted pretty much as it stands, City will need to be working out their least worst option. I think flat non-support is probably the most worst, because it will exclude us from having any influence. Hence being in support (or, at least, playing along for now) seems to me to be a better position at the moment.
So wrong Gareth on so many levels.
Quote from: KunDB on October 12, 2020, 15:56:29
So wrong Gareth on so many levels.
Ok then,
Well, I think that Liverpool (and Rags) will be engineering this so that City will be in a
lose:lose win:win situation. So in the event that their project proposal looks like it will be accepted pretty much as it stands, City will
need to be working out their least worst option greatly advantaged. I think flat non-support is probably
the most worst best, because it will exclude us from having any influence.
Hence being in support (or, at least, playing along for now) seems to me to be a better position at the moment.Happy now? :-* :-* :-*
Just been on red cafe and most really like it.Ido hope they go down.
Quote from: Gareth on October 12, 2020, 16:48:34
Ok then,
Well, I think that Liverpool (and Rags) will be engineering this so that City will be in a lose:lose win:win situation. So in the event that their project proposal looks like it will be accepted pretty much as it stands, City will need to be working out their least worst option greatly advantaged. I think flat non-support is probably the most worst best, because it will exclude us from having any influence. Hence being in support (or, at least, playing along for now) seems to me to be a better position at the moment.
Happy now? :-* :-* :-*
Don’t take it personal Gareth. The way to deal with a trap is never to walk into it. City need to block it period. It would hand power to a very tiny group of clubs who hate City and have only very recently plotted against City - letter to CAS.
Anyone got a link to the proposal?
I am not sure it has been fully published but here is a summary of proposal link.
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/12102347/project-big-picture-q-a-all-you-need-to-know-about-premier-league-shake-up-proposal (https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/12102347/project-big-picture-q-a-all-you-need-to-know-about-premier-league-shake-up-proposal)
So what would the proposal entail? Here are the key points:
The Premier League would be reduced from 20 to 18 clubs.
The EFL Cup and the Community Shield would be scrapped.
Current one-club one-vote principle would be abolished, as would rule that 14 clubs out of the current 20 need to agree on policy.
Power would be in the nine clubs that have remained in the Premier League longest (Arsenal, Chelsea, Everton, Liverpool, Man Utd, Man City, Southampton, Tottenham, West Ham).
Only six of the nine longest-serving clubs need to vote for major change.
A £250m payment up front to the EFL, plus £100m payment to the Football Association.
25 per cent of Premier League annual revenue (up from four per cent) would go to the EFL clubs.
Also
What other key changes have been suggested?
A reduction of teams in the Premier League from 20 to 18, with all fixtures played on weekends to create space for potential additions to the European calendar.
There would be two automatic promotion places from the Championship, with the teams finishing third, fourth and fifth entering a play-off with the 16th-placed Premier League side for the final spot.
The abolition of the League Cup and Community Shield, or at least the adaptation of the former to no longer include clubs in European competition.
The abolition of parachute payments for relegated clubs, to be replaced by a more equitable apportioning of the Premier League’s 25% revenue share. The Telegraph claim this is designed to ‘discourage Championship clubs from gambling recklessly on promotion’.
The capping of away tickets at £20, subsidised away travel, the possible return of safe standing and a guaranteed away allocation of 3,000 or 8% of stadium capacity, whichever is higher.
A later Premier League start in August to allow for more pre-season friendlies and an obligation for each team to compete once every five years in a summer Premier League tournament.
Alterations to the loan system allowing Premier League clubs to have 15 players out on domestic loan, including up to four at any one club, with the ability to recall players in the event of a managerial change.
Financial Fair Play regulations in line with UEFA.
League One to promote three clubs and relegate four each season; League Two to both promote and relegate four.
Clubs in League One and below would not be required to run an academy.
The creation of a new women’s league independent to the Premier League and FA.
Do the TV deals come into it?
The 3pm blackout would continue to be enforced, while no more than 27 games per club per season will be shown on live UK television.
This will allow Premier League clubs to retain the exclusive rights to sell eight live games a season to fans through their own digital platforms, with teams in the first and second tiers allowed to show limited highlights of games through the same means.
https://www.football365.com/news/what-is-premier-league-project-big-picture-liverpool-parry (https://www.football365.com/news/what-is-premier-league-project-big-picture-liverpool-parry)
And this thing about the nine clubs?
Perhaps the most contentious proposal is to supersede the current one-member one-vote system, whereby each club is given an equal say and a majority of 14 is needed to pass any new Premier League ruling. That would remain in certain votes but under ‘Special Voting Rights’ the nine clubs who have spent the most time in the top flight during their current spell would be granted “long-term shareholder status†and only six need to vote in favour of a change for it to be enforced.
Those teams â€" Arsenal, Chelsea, Everton, Liverpool, Manchester City, Manchester United, Southampton, Tottenham and West Ham at the time of writing, although Fulham and Stoke are among those that would have been granted such status in recent seasons â€" would be able to amend rules and regulations, remove the Premier League chief executive and even veto a new owner’s attempt to take over a rival club.
It's all part of the ADUG masterplan to eliminate indebted clubs.
Suffice to say that I'm strongly against and hope City vote against. Give the EFL their £250 million anyway though. Keep football alive without the power grab.
I'm confused, has this been proposed by the EFL or Rag/Dippers?
It has been proposed by the rags and dippers but the EFL are all for it since they get the cash they are after. Cash for power.
it's simple. It's all about indebted clubs desperately trying to keep themselves relevant. Well, I say for one, fuck em.
Quote from: reddishblue on October 12, 2020, 21:59:45
it's simple. It's all about indebted clubs desperately trying to keep themselves relevant. Well, I say for one, fuck em.
Amazing insight. Those clubs being the ones the PL deprived of revenue by rigging the distribution of monies and tried to shaft City’s takeover and development. I say fuck the dirty treacherous plotters of Utd, Liverpool and UEFA as they will eventually plot together to destroy City.
I would love to hear the justification for the proposals, that,
- 9 Clubs only should have the sole voting rights to determine the future of 72 clubs in the EFL and 11 PL clubs, and
- why 9 clubs should have a veto over other clubs ownership.
Also, the fact that Man City, Arsenal, Chelsea and Spurs were offered to join the EFL while maintaining their UEFA CL/Europa League places smacks of UEFA having been briefed and brought on board, before these 4 PL clubs were belatedly briefed, by Liverpool & Utd. This has been plotted over a few years secretively behind all other clubs backs and I suspect had to wait for Utd to get back into the CL before launching it.
It would conveniently fit in with the UEFA European league plans that they have been exposed to be hatching and I suspect entry to that will be dependent upon past performance in the competitions e.g. 1000 points for each time a club has won it and 100 points for each time a club has competed in the final group stages and 10 points for each time a club qualified for the preliminary stages or in other words RIGGED for Utd and Liverpool benefit.
City need to steer well clear of this or ensure a VETO which prevents changes that City consider to be detrimental to the clubs interest. Bear in mind these are the very clubs who a few months back tried to shaft City at CAS.
Another emerging clause
Tottenham Hotspur will be able to claim back around £125m for the costs of their new stadium and Liverpool around £30m on their newly-built Main stand under a clause in the "Project Big Picture" proposals.
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/project-big-picture-tottenham-stadium-22832882 (https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/project-big-picture-tottenham-stadium-22832882)
Also, The Times reports the EFL rejected a £375m offer from an American investment firm for a 20 per cent stake in the league that would have helped to solve the clubs' cash crisis
What the fuck? And Where's that money coming from?
The concept of cancelling the League Cup (Carabao) and only 18 teams to play less is bollocks.
As a consequence of this proposal the PL will start the season later, I wonder why?
Could it be to accommodate FIFA’s new Club World Cup and also to ensure clubs can still go on their lucrative summer tours of Asia and America.
So instead of playing less players will actually be playing more.
The Holy Grail for FSG, the Glazers and Stan Kroenke is to have their own rights to matches, and you pay for every game. Thus the untimely experiment launched last week £14.95 per game.
As Simon Jordan said "This empowers the big 6 and enables them to steer towards where they're really going which is to have a better relationship with Juventus, Bayern Munich and Barcelona and the European Club Association"
hidden agenda then
David Berstein stated in 2018:
"The Premier League does pay some monies across to other parts of football but it is nowhere near enough. My view has consistently been that the Premier League should be levied, money should go to the FA, which would be distributed to the wider game and which would make the selling of Wembley unnecessary.
"A Premier League tax if you like. It is a major, major issue. It is something that should be explored and, if necessary, looked at by government."
So I am glad to hear he has prepared alternative independent proposals to the Project Big Picture power grab proposals cooked up in a backroom deal.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/oct/14/david-bernstein-to-call-for-independent-regulation-in-fight-over-football-future (https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/oct/14/david-bernstein-to-call-for-independent-regulation-in-fight-over-football-future)
https://theathletic.com/news/premier-league-project-big-picture-latest/aIqc97tPyoIW (https://theathletic.com/news/premier-league-project-big-picture-latest/aIqc97tPyoIW)
Man U fixture list for next season has just been announced - here are their first 6 matches
Week 1 - Liverpool - H
Week 2 - Liverpool - A
Week 3 - Liverpool - H
Week 4 - Liverpool - A
Week 5 - Liverpool - H
Week 6 - Liverpool - A
Rejected as a proposal by all 20 PL clubs - so Utd and Liverpool rejected the proposal they spent 3 years developing. How humiliating.
It was more that they all agreed that it would never be endorsed rather than the rags and scousers actually voting against their own proposal. Nevertheless what a pair of cunts.
Quote from: gavin on October 14, 2020, 22:08:24
Nevertheless what a pair of cunts.
Oh yes, and that's not breaking news!!
Very pleased this isn’t moving forward, a shameless power grab at a desperate point for the EFL. Two Loathsome clubs instigating it, they should be ashamed but they aren’t.In fact they paint themselves as saviours! Rick Parry needs to be banned from all football his only allegiance is to Liverpool and he’ll move heaven and earth to make them unassailable to the detriment of all others.
It seems that common sense will prevail
Football should never, ever, be in the hands of a select group of 'elite' clubs. Every club should have the aspiration for promotion, improvement and expansion based on equality and planning. Isn't this why we have the Monopolies Commission in the private sector?
It's quite blatant that UEFA pander to a handful of clubs, more than likely due to corruption. If you look at the FFP timeline and who it's benefited and who's been punished, it's quite clear that it's a protectionist measure.
The whole idea stinks.
More shite.
English giants in talks to start a new 'European Premier League' via @OneFootball. Read it here:
https://1.ftb.al/CPMF3hgSJab
Yes, more breakaway and consolidation of power and money in the hands of a few eleite clubs ruining competitive football. Immediate threat is to the CL but ultimately it will also destroy domestic football.
Giants... bet they're feeling a bit small atm!
LFC and Utd at it again.
This can't happen. Logistics aside, isn't what they're doing essentially the champs league!?!??!
But let's look at the logistics, they're saying its in addition to the domestic leagues and cups.
And does that include the Champs league??
So
38 prem
36 Euro league
6 champs (minimum)
2 domestic cups (minimum)
Thats a minimum of 82 games a season. They're gonna fuck themselves over!
Bout time LFC and Utd are voted out the league!
Yep, chuck them both out and let them play with themselves.
seems to be a lot going on behind closed doors with FIFA also involved
dont fix it if it s not broken.
Aye, you can imagine FIFA "how much money did you say I was going to earn???"